LifePixel may have botched my camera conversion

[Andrea B.]

Andy Perrin, what is the update on the conversion? Please let us know.

[Andy Perrin]

Currently camera and my sharpest lens are on their way back to LP. Slight delay because UPS counts “business days” and Labor Day is not a business day.

[Andy Perrin]

Update:

 

Life Pixel says:

It had the wrong filter so we started from scratch and then tested your lens afterwards. I am very sorry as I am not sure how this happened.

 

Their customer service is fine but I’m still not impressed that they didn’t test it. Unless that’s what he means about not being sure how this happened.

 

Update 2:

The wrong filter was selected initially. For our dust and focus test shots that are done indoors, it passed with flying colors. We actually do not test infinity focus regularly as we know the filter we use corrects for this.

 

We messed up and I sincerely apologize.

 

If you ever want to convert another camera in the future, we will do it for half off.

 

Again, I like their customer service but I'm not impressed that they don't fully test their conversions. It seems like they could have saved both of us time and postage by taking a photo out the window before sending it off. The justification they give is circular logic - the test is what would have caught the wrong-filter issue.

[Cadmium]

Quote part two is what I find irritating.

'Another camera in the future?! For half price?!'

Did that make you happy? Have you already picked out another camera that you are thrilled about getting converted for half price?

People mess up sometimes, that is to be expected, if they resolve the problem, that is good, and that is also to be expected,

but if you ask me, they should give you half off this conversion, or maybe even for free, for their mistake, and your stress and inconvenience.

Fixing it is really not enough for me. It is good they are fixing it for you, but maybe not good enough, and their mistake is totally unacceptable, and I feel you deserve better compensation.

For their own 'future' business, it makes more business sense to fix the problem, refund your purchase, and then be more careful not to make such a mistake again.

However, I am glad they are fixing it for you at least, but I can't really imagine any business that would not do that.

I have always been a LifePixel fan, and I want to continue to be one, but somehow this resolution rubs me just a little the wrong way, and frankly makes me worry a little about sending them my next conversion.

As far as 'testing', I think if they are using the correct filter for the camera model, then they probably have no need to test the infinity,

but given the mistake of not using the correct filter, they have left you with a bad experience, one that doesn't reassure anyone reading this topic.

[Andy Perrin]

but if you ask me, they should give you half off this conversion, or maybe even for free, for their mistake, and your stress and inconvenience.

Yeah, I actually said that to my friend yesterday when I was describing this.

 

As far as 'testing', I think if they are using the correct filter for the camera model, then they probably have no need to test the infinity,

but given the mistake of not using the correct filter, they have left you with a bad experience, one that doesn't reassure anyone reading this topic.

If. The point of the test would be to identify exactly this issue.

[bobfriedman]

my guess is there was no testing other than a possible "on/off works".. they blindly modified the cam and sent it off.. the real question is did they modify it in such a way that they will require additional mods to fix... would be interesting to see the inside of the cam when they are done--

[Andy Perrin]

Bob, did you read the updates above? They simply replaced the filter with the correct one. I will quote it for you:

The wrong filter was selected initially. For our dust and focus test shots that are done indoors, it passed with flying colors. We actually do not test infinity focus regularly as we know the filter we use corrects for this.

Or are you suggesting they are lying to me, which we have no indication of, so far?

 

Anyway, at the moment I don't like either of them. If I do another one, currently I'm thinking Kolari would get my money.

[bobfriedman]

andy-- PM's are supposed to be just that - private.. there was no mention of maxmax in my PM. your reference is inferential.

 

i have no business relationship to maxmax other than a satisfied customer.. 4x D200's (2x UV-VIS-IR, 1x RG830 1x RG665), a D300s UV-VIS-IR, 4x D800 (1x RG830, 1x UV-VIS-IR, 1x RG715, 1x monochrome sensor conversion) - add it up since 2008 or so..

[Andy Perrin]

Bob, removed references to the PM, although since you referenced the guy upthread, I assumed it was fair game.

[Cadmium]

How often do most of us get cameras converted? Maybe every 5 years, seems typical to me.

I would ask them to apply the 50% discount to your current purchase.

Their mistake has caused you time and frustration, and you should not have to purchase from them again to get compensated for their mistake.

Your camera will have traversed the continent 4 times because they messed up.

You deserve a discount now, not if the future... a future which sounds like you have eliminated them from anyway, so get the discount now.

Ask them, if they are smart then they will credit you now.

[Andy Perrin]

Update:

 

Have received camera back, it focuses just fine (slightly past infinity now, but that's much less of an issue). It works fine in visible and IR. I haven't had a chance to test UV due to clouds/rain. I did ask LP for the half off on the current conversion. We will see if they are willing. I have no great confidence in them at the moment.

 

Camera itself is pretty amazing. I am not used to being able to snap a photo at ISO10000 and have it look nice.

[bobfriedman]

looking forward to seeing some images from your new conversion.

[Andrea B.]

I'm happy to hear that the problem with Andy's camera was only a matter of providing the correct filter. It never bothers me if such an error happens as long as it is fixed. Errors do happen in this world, you know. So we must try to deal with the occasional problem when it occurs without undue stress.

 

Heaven knows I've made a few errors myself in this life!! :D

 

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As far as the three major retail converters in the US, I would say from personal experience that Life Pixel, MaxMax and Kolari are all reputable. And any conversion problems I or others have had were fixedby the Big Three if reported and requested. (I've tried to get a couple of folks to report problems, but they did not.)

 

I have corresponded with all three conversion shops in the past to ensure that they were aware of the UV-contaminating internal IR shutter monitor problem which I was the unfortunate first to discover. All three converters have always promptly responded on any matter and been open about their work and methods.

 

We are still being occasionally surprised by that problem, which can be a bit sneaky to catch. You would think not, but turns out a host of factors play into this problem.

 

AFAIK, Life Pixel is the largest converter, whatever that might or might not mean.

 

 

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Typically the new sensor plane-to-mount distance is a known property for each camera which is set based on properties of the camera (FFD) and the replacement filter (refractive index). This distance cannot be accurate for every lens used on a converted camera, thus there is always an advertised focal length which is used for a standard measurement. So I certainly suspect that specific testing at infinity is not done because the converters do not own a stable of lenses for such testing across the various brands and camera models once the necessary distances have been computed. You are always free to send in a specific lens so that the measurements can be fine-tuned for a particular lens.

 

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As far as a partial refund when an error occurs? Maybe. If return postage was supplied by the converter to correct an error, then the original purchaser is out some non-professional time, but not out any money. In this world, it is the money which counts, not non-professional time. (Professional time is money, so that's perhaps different.) And any stress factor is not even considered in business errors. Sad but true. So you can ask for a refund of some amount, but I don't think you would get 50%. Maybe 10-25%?? Never hurts to ask, but don't be disappointed if you don't get it. I'm just stating facts here in this paragraph. That's the way it typically does work. That might not be the way it should work.

 

You know what I would do? Find a nifty used Panasonic Lumix G camera of some variety (maybe one or two generations old, but not the oldest) and get one of those dedicated UV conversions from Life Pixel for half off so I could use it for its amazing UV video. Birna and I have had Lumix-for-UV-video for years and love it!! (I need an update on my current GH1 Lumix body. I'm looking.)

[Andy Perrin]

As far as a partial refund when an error occurs? Maybe. If return postage was supplied by the converter to correct an error, then the original purchaser is out some non-professional time, but not out any money. In this world, it is the money which counts, not non-professional time. (Professional time is money, so that's different.) And any stress factor is not even considered in business errors. Sad but true. So you can ask for a refund of some amount, but I don't think you would get 50%. Maybe 10-25%?? Never hurts to ask, but don't be disappointed if you don't get it.

They chose not to even respond. I'm not that disappointed. My camera works, which is the main thing. I'm very annoyed at this highly preventable error that wasted my opportunity for shooting the Milky Way with it, but now I know I'm using Kolari next time!

 

I haven’t had a chance to test this camera in UV at all due to hurricane Florence, but I suspect the A7S with its high ISO capabilities may be good for video already.

[Andrea B.]

Andy, they all make mistakes sometimes. There is still a certain amount of "art" in this conversion process.

 

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I haven’t had a chance to test this camera in UV at all due to hurricane Florence

 

We too already look gloomy and rainy down here in central Jersey. It's like a jungle outdoors today with the heavy humid air. I suppose we will get some tail end of the wind lashing us from this big hurricane. The Carolinas are going to get smacked pretty hard.

[dabateman]

Well I went with Kolari for my Em1 conversion. I got it back yesterday. I went with them as they use quartz rather than 280 longpass. Also, since I wanted to maximize the uv, I asked to exclude the dust filter. So they recommended sending in my 9-18mm four thirds lens to confirm infinity focus.

Well using my 1000nm filter. Really a 950nm filter I do get infinity focus. So they did a great job. I closely inspected the sensor and see no dust at all.

The uv performance is amazing. With my reptile light, YUS lens at f5.6 ISO 3200, shutter speed 10 seconds I can see with my 313nm filter. Better than expected.

Overall I would recommend them, even though the person whom id my conversion wasn't named Dan.

[eye4invisible]

Life Pixel uses UPS for everything now.

Out of curiosity, I checked out their shipping instructions, and nothing has really changed in the past 3 years. For international customers, they still don't like you to ship it to them via UPS:

"International Customers: Please do not send a battery. Only ship via your country’s government postal system and on the customs forms please state in English: “temporarily sending digital still camera for modification/repair”. Please Do Not Ship via UPS, FedEx or any other private shipping company due to the importation brokerage fees they assess but if you must, please ship free domicile and not prepaid for UPS and for FedEx, make sure all duties, taxes, and brokerage fees are billed to the shipper. We will refuse acceptance of your package if these instructions are not followed."

[Andy Perrin]

Oh, that doesn't apply to me. I live in the US and they prefer UPS for US customers. Right under the part you quoted.

[Andrea B.]

Andy P -- could you please update this topic and let us know what happened? Did Lifepixel fix things? Thanks!!!

[Andy Perrin]

Andrea I did update it! You haven’t kept up with the thread. Please go back a page.

[Andrea B.]

I am a complete nimnutz !! :lol: :rolleyes: :excl: :o :o :o

After I returned from New Mexico, I've been laid low with a miserable toothache which required an emergency root canal on Monday. So I totally forgot I had read your update to this topic. Just today I've felt like getting back to see what was happening on the forum. I suppose I should delete my above stoopid comment. But let the record stand. B)

Today is the first day without 4 Advil every 4 hours. Thank goodness.

[Andy Perrin]

D’aww. Feel better soon!

[dabateman]

Andrea,

Sorry for your pain. I hope you feel better soon.

[Andrea B.]

Thanks, guys! I'm much better today. I think by tomorrow I won't be noticing it much.