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UltravioletPhotography

Cheap, replaceable and sensitive camera’s?


Avalon

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Hello. I’m curious if anybody could recommend cheap but sensitive, low risk modification camera’s to use for UV/IR photography? After attempting modify modern camera I came to realize they are too complex, brittle and expensive devices to us for modification.

 

Sony has very sensitive IMX322 0.0001Lux and yet inexpensive camera but unfortunately it only supports AHD DVR devices. Some CCTV camera’s are even made monochrome so they are even more sensitive especially to deeper UV.

 

USB camera’s aren’t so sensitive but it’s possible to find more sensitive and backlit CMOS camera’s. They can be even hooked to phones but unfortunately only having android system. Their lens are also easier to customize and I even seen sold M12 UV grade fused silica lens. Smaller sensors also mean cheaper filters.

 

I also consider modifying modern smartphone to full spectrum. My Lumia 640 has amazing sensitivity to low light conditions rivaling even Sony A3000. So I imagine it could make good UV/IR camera that will be also compact and easily portable. Not sure if it would easy to convert phone to full spectrum. Anybody tried using phones or such camera’s for this purpose?

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The cheapest that would be easy to modify would be a web camera. In the USA these have a common M12 mount and you can buy M12 quartz lenses from UKA optics. There are ones that are also monochrome for maximum sensitivity. These are easy to modify as most of the time the UV/IR block filter is in the lens unit and not on the sensor. You just twist out the lens and break off the filter. The 212 camera, that included a uv capable Fujinon 2.7mm f1.8 lens can be bought for $50. The block filter is near the sensor but easily comes off.

 

This is an other cheap one that is similar to the one on MaxMax website:

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-3MP-UVC-Linux-Android-Windows-Free-Driver-USB-Monochrome-Box-Camera-6mm-Lens/222929452759?hash=item33e7a17ed7:g:dKoAAOSw6n5XrUFp

 

This is the MaxMax already converted camera:

 

https://maxmax.com/shopper/product/15949-xniteusb2s-m-usb-2-0-megapixel-hd-monochrome-camera-uv-vis-ir/category_pathway-9475

 

For more advanced camera but really cheap and easy modification you can buy an Olympus EPL5 and follow this quick modificaton:

https://www.mu-43.com/threads/how-to-mod-olympus-e-pxx-cameras.44060/

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I tried an iPhone 4 but it is nearly insensitive to UV. One problem is that modern phone cams make the lens out of materials that cut UV (I suspect).
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I forgot to mention that the Axis 212 security camera is CS mount and Not an M12 mount. The Fujinon 2.7mm F1.8 fisheye lens if bought with the camera includes an adapter from its odd CS mount, which may not be standard to C-mount. The M12 mount is also sometimes called an S mount. The problem with security and web cameras is that the shutter speed is rarely less than 1/8 seconds. This really limits the amount of UV you will detect. You will need good UV lighting.

 

Best would be to get a E-PL5 for under $200. I just saw a couple on ebay listed for $180, and do the crack modification. No soldering and takes about 15 minutes. I have not done this yet though, as I do love my EM1.

 

David

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Cell phone cameras are a mixed bag---I have found some that can do UV without modification, whereas others will not. Cameras from cheaper flip phones are more likely to work, and you can pick up such phones for next to nothing, although you will not get the resolution that the higher-end smartphones have. But they are as good as webcams.
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eye4invisible

... CS mount, which may not be standard to C-mount.

Correct. Whilst CS mount has the same thread size as C mount, the flange focal distance is a little shorter for CS (12.5mm vs 17.526). You can use C mount lenses in a CS mount with a 5mm spacer.

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I made mistake about webcam lens size, it's actually M12 not M10. Webcam would work fine if I wouldn't need to carry laptop but just connect it to phone, maybe wireless could work?

 

Lens do not need UV blocking coating since IR-cut filter most often already blocks UV but AR coatings might block UV. Maybe coating be chemically removed? I do happen to have lots of small lens so I could modify original just autofocus mechanism might complicate things.

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Avalon,

I think you have to stop and think what what you really want to do. You need to answer these questions.

 

1. What type of uv photography do you want to capture, reflectance or fluorescence.

 

2. What type of final image do you want, monochrome (black and white only) or color?

 

3. What do you want to photograph? Macro, close up flowers, landscape, people, insects, birds, other stuff or mixture of these?

 

4. What is going to be you final media? A 8x10 printed photo, an online image archive, a movie, a 30x40 canvas wall print?

 

5. What is your budget? How much money are you willing to throw away?

 

I think I need to see you answer these questions before I lead you down any more wrong paths.

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1. Both

2. Color doesn't matter in UV reflected photography

3. Paintings, landscapes and all sorts things you mentioned

4. 10x15cm photos or digital photo media

5. Depends on quality I can get, want to keep budget to minimum.

 

I'm thinking about buying used or even broken screen smartphone such as Galaxy J5 which itself has good f/1.9 lens and modern sensor, as well Android OS so I could connect webcam with special app. I can find them under 20 Euro so not so much waste in case of failing to convert. Anybody had experience with these kinds of phones?

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Avalon,

 

Based on your responses I would say you would need a full spectrum converted camera. Based on your print dimension at 300 dpi you have 1800 x 1200 = 2.1 Mpixels and at 600 dpi you would need 8.6 Mpixels. I don't think you would be happy with a web camera, which typically are less than 2 Mpixels. They also will not be good for landscape.

 

So a camera that I would recommend for you based on your responses would be the Sigma Quantro SDQ. They are about $500 Used now, however Sigma just abandoned the SA mount. So I think if you watch they will be cheaper soon. You can convert it to full spectrum by simply removing the internal dust cover. It offers great UV response, live view and will be Monochrome for reflective UV work. However the camera is also full color when looking at UV induced fluorescence. You can easily add lenses using M42 mount adapters which are cheap. Also these cameras are excellent for general High resolution photography.

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  • 5 months later...

I already have full spectrum modified Sony A3000 camera, what I'm looking now for is portable IR/UV camera with good sensitivity that can in the pocket, phones are good candidates.

HTC phones have bigger pixel area by utilizing Ultrapixel technology which basically is using using low megapixel such as 4Mp sensors which provide better sensitivity, reduce noise and exposure time. Lumia phones have less megapixels and bigger pixel area but they use lower aperture lens, while Samsung has lens f/1.7 and even 1.5. Of course there are technologies such as ISOCELL sensors that have better sensitivity than BSI CMOS sensors. Can't find sensor sizes of all phones.

 

How difficult it could be to remove IR/UV cut filter from new phones without significant damage and can lens be replaced? I had idea of replacing Lumia 640 f/2.2 lens with f/1.7.

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Andy Perrin
Some phones do not even use IR/UV cut filters. They simply make the lens out of UV/IR blocking material. So there is nothing to remove. I have converted an iPhone 4 in the distant past and it had horrid UV sensitivity but decent IR. In that phone, the blocker was part of the case so simply removing the window on the case was sufficient to convert it to IR. (I replaced it with R72 glass.)
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I think a small point-and-shoot camera might work for what you want. Used ones can be found for very little $$$.
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Point n shoots must have improved the lenses over time no doubt. Used to be good converts. But your point is well made. :)
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  • 3 weeks later...

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